WFR/Shuttle 4ZB1 and Piazza 4ZC1 loom wire colours.

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GeminiCoupe
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WFR/Shuttle 4ZB1 and Piazza 4ZC1 loom wire colours.

Post by GeminiCoupe »

Hey blokes,

Im after the colours and functions of the three wires running from the plugs on each of the following:

Isuzu WFR/Shuttle 4FB1 Alternator plug
Isuzu piazza 4ZC1 Alternator Plug

Ive grabbed a reco 4FB1 Alt off a shuttle along with the block brackets to throw it onto the Piazza, need to know if theres any wiring differences other then the plug.

Nick-
project - 76 Gemini Coupe G200z EFI Turbo
daily - 02 S15 Nissan 200SX GTspecS Turbo
wet-weather fun toy - TX 75 Gemini Sedan G200z
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Post by wedgenut »

Most of these have the same functions regardless of wiring colors. Apart from the main battery lead the three witres going into the wiring plug are as follows. If you look at the back of the alternator it should have the three terminals marked on the casting as IG, L, & S. Ig is obvious, it is a hot wire from the ignition circuit when ignition is on and is usually Black with white tracer. The L terminal is the charge light connection and is usually white with a green tracer. The S terminal is a power supply from the battery and is usually white and comes from one of the fusible links near the battery. Essentially this powers up the alternator. The big fat lead on the Batt terminal is of course the main charge lead. The colours should be correct for the Piazza but i haven't got a clue what they are for the WFR but it shouldn't matter if the plugs are the same and the terminal ID on the casting is the same. This arrangement is quite common for all alternators with internal regulator. This is assuming the alternators are Nippon denso which were Original equipment although i have seen a few Bosch two wire jobs out there as well. Hope this helps
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Post by GeminiCoupe »

Thanks Alex, huge help. Your slab is in the mail :drinkers: :drinkers:

Its the factory style Nippondesno alt and has the same style round green plug as the piazza one. I havent gotten around yet to ripping them off and doing the swap - bob was saying the plugs were different on the early shuttles which is why i thought id check.

Nick-
project - 76 Gemini Coupe G200z EFI Turbo
daily - 02 S15 Nissan 200SX GTspecS Turbo
wet-weather fun toy - TX 75 Gemini Sedan G200z
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Post by Bugle »

Yer my 4ZC1 shuttle alt has the same plug except teh shuttle only uses 2 of the 3 wires and the Piazza uses all 3 for some reason. The shuttle alt still has the pin there.

The Bosch alt I had on the car before only used 1 wire luckily they didn't chop the original plug just stuck a spade connector on a wire off the alt into the original plug..
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Post by wedgenut »

Thanks Alex, huge help. Your slab is in the mail
If I had known beer was at stake I would have made the story more complex and talked about spooling rates and core flux, fark knows what it all means but it sounds teknikul
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Post by wedgenut »

OOPS forgot what I was going to say. The green plugs can be deceptive. In most the lateral pin is exactly central above the two vertical pins but you might come across one where the lateral pin is slightly OFF centre and of course won't fit. Change the plugs over as well but just make sure the L, S and IG pins are arranged in the same position, if not cut and tuck the wires to suit.

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Post by Rodeobob »

Nah the 1.8L alternator has a Green plug and its round but on the wrong end. Thats the bit you pull and its got two lock tabs off it one on each side. The actual bit that goes into the alternator is rectangles. Two pins flat on the bottom and one at 90deg, if that makes sense.

Image

Its written on there which one it is, is that the one you got???? You can see it mounts different than the E1 alt which is the same as the Piazza, 2L shuttle and 4ZD1 alt.

Its still the same number of wires.
That pic was for an alt upgrade to internal reg for a Gemini motor.
Here i chopped down a better pic.
E1 left and B1 on the right.
Image

So does it look like the one on the right???
I wish i had my scanner working.

Bob.
Too many Piazzas to little money.

Currently unemployed. Watch this space.
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Post by Rodeobob »

This is what i found.
E1 Plugs look like this, so does all other 4Z except the B1.
The E1 plug is round and stays like that all the way on the outside. The Shuttle plug looks like the terminals pictured below. only the top bit is round and the lower half that plugs in is two rectangles.
I will try and get some pictures.

Image

Heres the diagram.
Image

I forgot to write on there, The B wire is the C2 plug above. The "L" wire is pin 2 on "C3" plug and the "IG" wire is pin 3. Pin one is not used as im pretty sure the earth wire, again not marked but can be seen in the diagram, is its own seperate wire.

Heres the Shuttle diagram
Image
Unfortunately all ive got to work with is the main diagram as the Petrol engine electricals section is missing out of the manual. This diagram covers both the 1.8L and 2L motors. It does show the three terminals, "B", "IG" and "L".

Hope that sorts you out.

One thing i will mention. If you have to cut the Piazza plug off to fit the Shuttle on be sure and solder and heat shrink the wires.
I dont see that you will need too, im sure with a small flat blade screw driver you will be able to push the tabs and get the terminals out of the plugs to swap em over.

Cheers. Bob.

P.S. it was my pleasure posting big pictures that make the page a kent to read. lol.
Too many Piazzas to little money.

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Post by Bugle »

Damn thats a bit of a difference with the mounting and everything..
Wouldn't it be easier to just use an original shape alternator? RB Geminis use them although with a different pulley attached and they're plentiful at wreckers.
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Post by Rodeobob »

Nah if hes got the mount with the alternator it will bolt straight on the block.
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Post by GeminiCoupe »

Yeha thats the alternator i have, big baulky looking mofo. Cant complain for $30 with warranty, especially considering it looks brand new! The engine i pulled it off had about 1,000,001 oil leaks which resulted in about 1" thick grease caking the block, yet the alternator in comparision looked polished with not a drop of oil on it. Got the mounts, plug and all so it should be too hard now.

Im quickly finding out how hard these cars are to work on - no wonder every Holden dealer hated them. I had to rip off all the intake pipes to get good access to the bolts on the damn thing.

Nick-
project - 76 Gemini Coupe G200z EFI Turbo
daily - 02 S15 Nissan 200SX GTspecS Turbo
wet-weather fun toy - TX 75 Gemini Sedan G200z
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Post by Rodeobob »

GeminiCoupe wrote:Im quickly finding out how hard these cars are to work on - no wonder every Holden dealer hated them. I had to rip off all the intake pipes to get good access to the bolts on the damn thing.

Nick-
Do it from underneath, easy as. Well easy as working on a Piazza is ever gunna be.

Bob
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Currently unemployed. Watch this space.
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Post by GeminiCoupe »

Yeah the old man suggested i go from underneath as well, although i laughed at that. Despite the fact it looks high as a mofo, theres fuck all clearance to get under the car, especially seeing i dont have ramps or stands. That, and the fact im only 175cm/70kg [not exactly the biggest bloke in the world] means i find it easy to crack bolts when im pushing down using my weight then pushing up [like from underneath].

Ill get it off, dont you worry. Fucked up and missing tools and all :finga: :drinkers:

Nick-
project - 76 Gemini Coupe G200z EFI Turbo
daily - 02 S15 Nissan 200SX GTspecS Turbo
wet-weather fun toy - TX 75 Gemini Sedan G200z
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Post by Bugle »

Bob you sure about that fitting? It may attach to the block but will it interfere with anything else? The Piazza 4ZC1 has a completely different mount to the Shuttle 4ZC1 not sure if it mounts it lower or something to clear the turbo i'll have a look.
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Post by wedgenut »

Im quickly finding out how hard these cars are to work on - no wonder every Holden dealer hated them. I had to rip off all the intake pipes to get good access to the bolts on the damn thing.
Ya don't know the half of it lad, in my young days we had to walk to school 18 miles each way in bare feet in the snow and it was uphill both ways, it was dark when we left and dark when we got back, on the weekend when we saw the sun we thought the moon was on fire! and you think a Piazza alternator is tough............. wait until you gotta change the power steering pump, there are two types the really difficult one and the bloody impossible one. If I have to take mine off again I'm not putting it back on, I'll run some extension hoses to the back and buy a little korean to sit under the hatch and spin it by hand. That wasn't very PC. I meant a vetically challenged under achiever of asian origin with superior dexterity.

That isn't really the whole truth, it was only 17 miles :finga:
So many cars, so little cash
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