Piazza_man project

Post by **wedgenut** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:53 am

Righto, everything you need to know in full living colour is in the tech section

http://www.isuzupiazza.com/forum/viewto ... 2167#12167

just ask if anything is unclear, but even an auto electrician should be able to follow this

Post by **Piazza_man** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:38 am

I said it before and I'll say it again. Freakin genius.

IZU069 · Post by **IZU069** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:53 am

x2!

And that is VERY different mechanically to what I described.
It would be a bummer if needing to adjust it just a bit, but it looks like the Isuzu lads had the 2 positions in minds. (How strange - most others would have built a different gear... ]

Lucky we have Wedgy - a continued line of genii (or geniuses if he has peers).

Post by **Piazza_man** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 11:01 am

Hail Wedgy.

IZU069 · Post by **IZU069** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 11:22 am

I am in total agreement.

Mind You eyecon, you are not doing too bad yourself.
(Sorry, I have to hold back. It's one of those "new kid in the block" things. Just because they account for most of the recent site activity and post brilliant references, pics, articles etc.. Well, you understand... Not that I am qualified to denigrate etc (that's not the right word...) - I've never had a Piazza on the road and I've barely worked on them. Whereas You on the other hand...)

Post by **Piazza_man** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 11:58 am

Some would argue I have totally lost my mind tempting fate with Piazzas, but I call it a hobby and enjoy getting on here and talking with like-minded guys, and learning stuff along the way. I don't mind being a newbie because in many ways I still am. Keeping the passion alive is the best thing I can bring to the table.

Post by **wedgenut** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 6:56 pm

Thanks guys, it's no big thing, I have a couple of things to say

1. Double check operation BEFORE fitting the arm to ensure it is parking at the end of the up stroke, just in case I got my clockwise and anti-clockwise all topsy turvy upside downy. I am very very old and have been wrong in the past.....once! Well once that I remember...now what was I saying...nope sorry its gone.

Oh yes 2

Often forums like this can become stale and stodgy and it depends on new people coming through to keep it bubbling along, it doesn't need thousands of members to work, just a few with a desire to keep the marque alive and improve their knowledge. Sharing of info is what it is about, there is so much they don't teach in this age of plug in OBD readers that true mechanics are a dying breed that are being replaced by computer savvy fitters with no grime under their finger nails. No disrespect intended, it is a sign of the times. So the true geniuses here are the new younger members with an eye for preserving what will otherwise be lost.

So cut through Peters rants and you will find golden nuggets of electronic wisdom, Bob too is a wizard on Piazzas and there are others with damn good knowledge, not all of us are on here as often as they used to be but ask questions and you will get answers that you can hopefully add your two cents worth to and pass on to others.

Post by **Piazza_man** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 7:28 pm

Re point 1. There's an easy fix to checking the operation of the arm after re-positioning. Just take the damn arm off as a precaution. Then mark part of the moving shaft with with whiteout so the movement can be clearly seen and checked. I've actually got a spare wiper motor in my garage. I might reset that one and remove the other one.

Post by **wedgenut** » Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:23 pm

HOLD EVERYTHING< put you crook..a bit. Let me explain. When you have the ignition on and you switch off your wiper it will continue the sweep until it gets to the park position, IF however you turn off the ignition with the wiper still on the wiper stops immediately exactly where it is which may be in mid sweep. The one in the pictures I put up must have had the power cut when operating because the vigilant would notice the arm spindle crank is in mid position in the first picture when it should be at one extreme or the other. The logical assumption then is that the correct rest position would have the gearwheel crank in either the 3 o'clock or 9 o'clock position and not as shown in the first picture. So moving it 90 degrees is incorrect. It will need to move 180 degrees to change the park position so when you open yours up whichever position the pivot bar is located in needs to be changed 180 degrees without moving the gear wheel.

I will edit the posting to fix this cock up

So much for genius, maybe the brain was having Sunday off

IZU069 · Post by **IZU069** » Mon Apr 23, 2012 4:22 pm

Even genii have their Sabbath.

Post by **Piazza_man** » Tue May 29, 2012 11:08 pm

Righto, last week the the whole drivetrain was removed to deal with varous oil leak issues in the diif and gearbox area. The undercarraige will have to be de-greased as a result.

The diff has now been serviced and ready to be delivered back to the workshop. Just sorting out another manual transmission from rodavo, which will be serviced and getting the once over to make sure everything is OK internally and will be treated with new bearings for good measure.
I'll keep the original box because it's the 4th gear cog and input shaft that need replacing. The rest of the gears seem fine. The bottom cog is 4th gear with it's teeth badly worn and scuffed due to lack of oil in the system. The input shaft is to the left of the 4th gear cog.

Here you see the aftermarket heavy duty clutch that rodavo installed before I picked it up.

Bugle · Post by **Bugle** » Wed May 30, 2012 10:40 pm

Sure the gear that it runs onto on the counter shaft hasn't worn aswell? It's not 4th gear, it's the main drive gear. 4th gear doesn't have any gears at all, it locks the input shaft to the output shaft with the synchro on the right of the pic. That gear would be the first to wear out because it only gets a rest when you're in 4th.

Post by **Piazza_man** » Thu May 31, 2012 12:07 am

Bugle wrote:Sure the gear that it runs onto on the counter shaft hasn't worn aswell? It's not 4th gear, it's the main drive gear. 4th gear doesn't have any gears at all, it locks the input shaft to the output shaft with the synchro on the right of the pic. That gear would be the first to wear out because it only gets a rest when you're in 4th.

Sorry Bugle you lost me when you said 4th gear doesn't have any gears. Gearboxes aren't my thing. All I'm told, and was physically shown, was that the 4th gear was badly worn as was the input shaft, and oh yes I forgot to mention, the main (output) shaft. I assume the counter shaft is the external looking shaft running along the top of the picture? No they're fine. No scuff marks and excessive wear on any of them, especially the one attached to cog that drives 4th gear.

Have a look at the meat still left on top of the cog. That I'm told is fine.

This cog is badly worn, scuff marks and all:

I had a look at this site, but couldn't find anything for MSG-5H transmissions. So many versions of the MSG gearbox out there:
www.drivetrain.com/parts_catalog/manual ... l_kit.html

I tried to make some sense of it re compatibility with with the other MSG transmission, but in the end I sent an email with my problem and what I needed from them. That was a couple of days ago, and I haven't heard from them as yet. I wouldn't mind getting the necessary parts and rebuilding the transmission to have as spare

Post by **wedgenut** » Thu May 31, 2012 4:19 am

Maybe this will help you understand the gear box a bit better, There are "constant mesh" gears and selected gears. If you look at you main cluster image, the input shaft is the one on the left that your clutch is splined on to. The main or output shaft is the one right through the centre of the gears and selectors that sticks out to the right and connects to your prop shaft. Th short shaft at the top of the picture is the counter shaft/ When you engine is running and you are in neutral with your foot OFF the clutch a whole lot is happening. The input shaft is going round and its gear, 1st on the left is turning the counter shaft which in turn is turning every cog in mesh with it all the way along. The only thing that isn't turning is the output shaft through the centre of all this mayhem. These are your constant mesh gears. When you select a gear the sliding hubs connected to the forks transmit this motion from the constant mesh gears to the output shaft because the hubs are splined to the output shaft. The ONLY time these constant mesh gears stop turning is when you put your hoof on the clutch which disconnects engine drive from the input shaft. It follows then that if any of the gears are badly worn the associated gear it meshes with is normally also worn.

Post by **Piazza_man** » Thu May 31, 2012 8:31 am

Gotcha Wedge, but you can see for your self the associated counter shaft cog is in far better condition. Er maybe I should get a clearer pic. Technician told me the reason why one is worn more than the other is due most likely due to inferior quality of metal, or poor metal batch. Anyway I'm here at the gearbox technician place and take some more pics and clarify a few things.